Micah Autry on Leadership in Public Speaking

John: You’re listening to The Present Professional, where we explore the intersections of personal and professional development.

John: To change your experience of life and work with every episode. So tune in, grab your notebook, and let’s go. Let’s go. Welcome to another episode of The Present Professional. Today, we have a special guest with us, Micah Autry, host of the Secrets of Silent Success podcast. And today, we’re here to have a conversation about leading in public speaking and how you can approach these events that you have coming up. You can approach speaking to your team, to an audience, and different ways that we’ve all utilized in our public speaking events. We’re super excited to share that with you guys. Before we get into the conversation, I want to give Mike a moment to introduce himself.

Micah: Yeah. So as he said, my name is Micah Autry, uh, the founder and host of the secrets of silent success podcast. I’m also a co-founder of on media, which is a multimedia production company based out of Dallas, Texas, uh, focusing on commercials, films, things of that nature. And, uh, we’ve been in business seven years now. So full-time entrepreneur for seven years do also a little bit of real estate investing and, um, now transitioning into doing more public speaking, more focused to the younger demographic, your high school and collegiate students.

Tony: So yeah, and know Tony from high school. So there you go. Wow. Yep. Yep. And we have a call at 830 in the morning tomorrow.

Micah: Yes, we do.

Tony: So, Micah, you said you’re doing a little bit of public speaking. Earlier we were talking, you said you had a event this morning that you did. What was the topic about and what was that like preparation wise?

Micah: Yeah, so this morning was two of six presentations I’m doing for Tarrant County Community College up there in the Fort Worth area of Dallas. And today we were talking about leadership. And one of the things that I focused on mostly was communication. I think as a leader, you got to have effective communication from the standpoint of literally having a vocabulary to express your point. English fails us a lot of times. All right. Also talked about fight and flight response or fight, flight and freeze response or F3 responses. So things like that, you know, just know who’s on your team, so forth.

John: That’s a big thing to address before you go in to address a room, right, is what comes up for you as a speaker.

Micah: Yeah.

John: So what’s some of the things that you use personally to deal with your own fight or flight response or if you even experience that? I don’t know. Tell us a little bit more about that.

Micah: Yeah, I’m human, so I definitely experienced it. One thing that has stuck with me, I can’t remember who said it or where I found it, but in terms of the chemical elements in your body and the way your body responds, excitement. And fear, or anxiety, fear, stress, anxiety, are the exact same elements, right? Your hands get clammy, your heart rates, you may feel the urge to go to the restroom, things like that. All of that is the same whether you’re excited or whether you’re fearful. So when I go, or I’m about to go on stage and present, or I’m about to go into a big meeting, I’m excited for the meeting. I turn on some music and I’m bobbing my head, I’m excited. I’m not fearful, I just lie to myself and say, hey, you’re excited, right? Because it’s the exact same endorphins getting pushed through your brain.

John: Yeah. It’s funny that you mentioned I lie to myself, but your body doesn’t know that. No. That same auto response in your body, it’s going to react the same way, but the story that you tell yourself is supporting you going on stage.

Micah: or anything in life, it’s all about the story you tell yourself. Not to already go on a tangent on the podcast, but whatever you tell yourself in life is your reality, right?

John: Exactly, exactly. It’s kind of what we mentioned in the episode on becoming resilient, right? And it’s not what happens to you, it’s how you experience it. And it’s the same thing when you get up, not just in front of a big room to speak publicly, but a lot of folks that can happen even just in a meeting at work, getting up to give a presentation in front of your boss. little things like that. What are some of the things that you use, Tony?

Tony: Man, you know, when you said that, it made me think about the difference between giving a speech or giving a talk at work with your team versus an audience as a public speaker. To me, that’s two totally different things. Like, if it’s a public speaking event, I’m excited, like you said. I may be a little fearful, but I feel more like an athlete, you know? Like, I’m getting ready to go into the big arena, and I’m about to give a big speech. To performance. Probably may or may not have been paid. Just depends. That also, you know, makes a difference. But when you’re at work and you got to give that speech, it’s really, it feels a lot more political. You’re really worried about how you’ll be received. You’re thinking about whether or not you’re giving the right content. You might even have imposter syndrome. It really just depends because the environment changes because the audience is different. They’re going to see you again. They’re going to see you tomorrow. They’re going to maybe team you or message you after the conversation and say, I don’t know if that was right. You know, it’s a little bit different for me, but I love the ability to get that adrenaline rush when I get up to speak, man. It feels amazing.

Micah: Yeah. I like the idea, as you said. It’s kind of like a sport. You’re an athlete up there. That’s your arena, if you will. That’s cool.

John: Let’s see where this question goes. What if you did approach meetings at work or some of the things where you’re thinking about more of the politics of the room and understand what you mentioned about the audience changing? But how do you think the audience would receive you if you showed up in that same energy that you show up in front of a room, an audience?

Tony: Man, that’s a good question. I think that for me, I do a good job either way because I just try to tailor my message to fit probably a smaller bite-sized sample, whatever I have to say. Because if it’s a team meeting, you probably don’t have 30 minutes to 45 minutes to just talk, right? You got to be concise. You got to get to the point. You got to be quick. You may even have to throw in some jokes. So I try to approach it like that, but I think the biggest difference for me when it comes to work, business, speech, and whatever it may be is my energy, right? Because if it’s a work event, you may feel like, ah, you know, I got to do this. I got to do that. But when you’re on stage and you’ve been invited, you’re more like, I have to do this. I get to do this. This is an opportunity. It is a privilege to be on this stage. And I think we got to have that same energy when it comes to team meetings, one-on-one conversation, whatever it may be.

Micah: Yeah, I would say that my vernacular is different, especially for me when it’s a team meeting, these are my friends that I’m meeting with being that it’s, you know, our company. So the vernacular is way different, right? But one thing that I believe stays consistent is the preparation for the meeting, for the talk, and even for personal talks. Me and my wife, the beginning of every month, we have a sit-down meeting. And like, I have a prepared meeting agenda about the things to go over. And I say, I’m an avid note taker. Handwritten notes. I have sticky notes everywhere. I have legal pads everywhere. In college, it was tablets everywhere. So before I have a presentation, before I have a meeting with maybe a potential client, before I have a meeting with my wife, I’m writing down all those handwritten notes. And it helps me make the content real, materialize it, helps me memorize it. Handwritten notes is my secret to success, right? And I use that regardless of the meeting, the speaking, the presentation. I’m writing it all down.

John: Wow. Bringing that up about what you do with your wife, I think that’s so beautiful. I think it’s something that you can co-create as well. Let’s sit down and think about the list of questions that we want to revisit together. And maybe they change a little bit every month, but that kind of check-in, real, authentic, honest check-in so it doesn’t let things slip through the cracks or let animosity or anything build up. So then you don’t have any explosions, right? You just kind of sit down, have a real talk. I think that’s really beautiful. How has that worked out for you? Just sharing with the listeners.

Micah: Yeah, it’s worked out for me well, both personally and in business. And so you talked about explosions and animosity. I’m the opposite. I’m a people pleaser. I’m kind of passive in my fight or flight response. I’m a flight. I’m a run from it. Right? So if I have, you know, tough topics to go over in a company meeting or talking to a potential client about pricing, right? Or, you know, maybe bringing up something that’s uncomfortable at a public speaking presentation, me going to therapy, right? If I don’t have those things written down in front of me, I may skip over it because it’s hard to talk about. but I’m a very analytical guy, and so if it’s number three on my list, I will have to hit number three on my list, or it’s going to grind my gears, right? So literally, if I’m talking to my wife, or I’m going over things in a meeting agenda, or if I’m talking in a presentation on a PowerPoint, if it’s written down and it’s number three, no matter how uncomfortable number three is, I’m going to say number three. And it comes out before I can even realize it. I’m like, okay, well, we’re here now, right? But it’s because I wrote it down. I held myself accountable to it.

Tony: you know, I was going to chime in and say, you know, I have definitely have meetings with my wife as well. We have whiteboard meetings. We got, it’s crazy. But, you know, what I, what I noticed in like practice of being a better and more effective communicator is the better I communicate with my loved ones or people around me that see me all the time, the easier it is when I meet a stranger or the easier it is when I’m in conversation with a large audience because I’m already in motion of being a good communicator. If I’m just talking to people raw, I’m likely to do the exact same thing when I get on stage and you talk about that vernacular, it’s just going to change. My code switch might change. I might just be flying off the handle and I’m like, did I just say that? Yes, you did.

Tony: Call my boss bro.

Micah: You talked about communicating with others. how do you communicate with yourself? Not in like a weird talk and answering, but in a practicing manner, right? Every presentation, I’m in my office just going at it. My wife hears me like talking to myself in there. I’m like practicing this cadence, this tempo, this joke here with this joke now, talking to a fake audience. How does your preparation for speaking and communicating to yourself work?

Tony: You’re talking about in preparation for a speech or just in general?

Micah: I would say for a speech or for a meeting, because if I’m going into a meeting with, you know, the biggest client I’ve ever met with, I’m practicing that speech too. So how does that work for you?

Tony: Man, I try to go like zero to a hundred when I’m by myself. So if I’m preparing or if I’m like building something, like if it’s a PowerPoint deck or even if it’s a brochure or a real presentation that has to go to you know, a client, like you mentioned, I’m thinking about the end. I’m thinking about every single thing that they may ask, every single thing that I need to get my point across with, or even the amount of time that I have to spend if I get the business with the client. I’m thinking about all of that in my preparation so I don’t miss anything. I may overdo it actually, so I’m just done. Even if it doesn’t, it leads to nothing, or even if it, it may take six months to a year for them to get back to me, at least it’s done. And when it’s done, it’s off my mental. And then I feel good about it because I can look at the work that I was able to produce and just be like, man, that was A1, bravo. That’s how I talk to myself.

Micah: I’m like, great job, Tony.

Tony: Great job. And then I move on. What about you, John? Because you in the thick of things. So like, same question to you. Like, how do you get prepared for client meetings and all the things that you do?

John: Man, I’ll tell you what, when you brought up speaking to yourself, I mean, that’s a big thing. And the one thing that I wanted to point out from one thing that you mentioned about, it sounds like you’re really starting to get to know yourself really well. that I’m an analytical person. I make the list because I know that sets me up for success. While that might not be the same for me or Tony, and you went into how you go into it with zero to 100, but it’s all about knowing how that we show up ourselves the best. I’m going to answer that question in, how do I get to know myself? I get to know myself by actually spending time with others, but in a way that’s more reflective. in asking them questions about what they think. What do you feel like is something that’s most challenging for me? Sometimes interviewing people that will answer me honestly can help me find blind spots that I can’t find in just knowing myself or having conversations with myself. When I’m approaching a public speaking event or a major talk with a new client, one thing that always works for me is bouncing it off of someone objectively that will be an honest mirror to me and will not be just a supportive mirror that’s going to tell me what I want to hear in the moment, like great job. It’s using and utilizing my network and those close to me that I know will be honest with that. Like you, Tony, I know you’d be honest with me and that I can share that and say, what do you think? What do you think about this? How does that come off? Like on a cold eyes view, how does that sound to you? That helps me, but then self-dialogue, I will speak it out. So before a talk or something, I will speak it out to a mirror, just in the shower, just whenever I just anytime that I get. But I also try to quiet my mind a lot too. and not have because when I get up on stage or when I get in front of the room, I want to be able to let that just flow and not have an inner dialogue about what should I say, how is it coming off, anything. I think my mindfulness and self-awareness practice is just as much of a big part of it as the dialogue itself. So being able to quiet the mind and let my speech or the meeting flow through from the preparation.

Micah: I’m going to dive a little bit deeper into that because I feel that there’s a pain point of mine. It’s quieting that inner dialogue. Because when I’m in the audience, especially if it’s like a 15 to 30 person audience, you can see facial expressions. It’s like, that person’s into it. I’m not sure about that person. I don’t think this person likes me at all. Right? And so how do you quiet that dialogue down? And maybe, hey, you You got to care less about the audience and present. I’m like, hey, I want everybody to love it. But what are some of your techniques for quieting that inner dialogue down, if you will?

John: Yeah. So one, it’s all in the preparation beforehand, too. And it’s really limiting the, not limiting, yet reducing reactivity. What a meditation practice does or your self-awareness practice, mindfulness practice, what it does is separates that distance between stimulus and response. Instead of seeing the person looking at you while you’re on stage and Immediately reacting like oh and then you see the story start. What are they thinking? Oh, I’m a bad speaker. I Didn’t prepare enough. I’m But that’s not serving me in the moment, right? So it’s the preparation with your self-awareness practice beforehand Helps you see that and the story doesn’t start yet. So what I do in that moment is is act and Sometimes I’ll look right in that person’s eyes and speak directly to that person. Someone that’s not engaged, when the speaker, when you look directly in their eyes for a couple sentences, they’re like, all right, I’m paying attention. I’m paying attention. I’ll change that. Or in preparation for the talks, I’ll try to have different things to engage the audience as well, even physically. Like, OK, raise your hand if, or who’s ever experienced this. And sometimes if it’s a small enough audience, if anyone’s willing to share. And another awesome thing is knowing if you know a few people in the audience, and you have some angels out there, that you can point to in a time of, OK, we need someone to get engaged here and be able to stand up and speak about something that you’re talking about. And then everyone feels a little bit more comfortable. That can be another saving grace. But I’d say, mentally, what I do in that moment is I’ll look right at that person, see them, speak to them. And it’s the same thing that happens in the yoga studio for me, actually. Because when you teach to one person, the whole room hears it and listens. I can give someone a cue in a yoga class, send your knee up towards the top right of your mat, John, and talk to someone specifically, and you’ll see everyone else in the room’s knees move. So that’s what I do. rather than darting around and seeing how everyone’s receiving it, it’s like I’ll speak to one person in the room and move to another person and move to another person. So then it makes it a little bit more intimate for me.

Tony: Wow. Yeah, that was powerful, man. I was going to say, just to piggyback off of that, is I definitely get the audience involved. That just helps me feel better as a speaker if I’m able to relate. maybe even telling them to stand up, like you said, raise a hand. I may crack a joke. Like I had a speech not too, maybe a few weeks ago, and the thunder struck right when I was about to say something. And I’m like, did y’all hear that? Like, you know, just getting everybody loose, you know, versus just being so, you know, lectury. And another thing that I do is I try to take you know, speaking gigs that speak to me. Like, if it’s within my wheelhouse, I’m on it. But if it’s stuff that’s a little outside of my, not even comfort zone, I would just say my expertise, I try to just either pass that on. Like, I definitely have probably passed things, like, hey, John, this may be better for John than me, or, you know, I have another friend I may call on, but… It just helps me feel better as a speaker. And when you talk about preparation, now I can really dive deep into a subject and really give it my all as opposed to spending a lot of time doing a lot of research on something that I really don’t know anything about.

Micah: No, I love that. You talked about distractions with a thunderstorm. I did a speech for the Young Men’s Service League. It was the Plano chapter. And we were inside an airplane hangar, which is really cool, but it’s like a metallic building. And there was a thunderstorm. They had the big barn door open. So I’m up there. I mean, it starts to like hailing outside. people running, when, and I’m like, all right, I’m just going to stop and like tell jokes for like seven minutes, right? Because it’s completely distracted. No one is even penetrating to anymore. I’m like, hey, give it up for the moms in the back with the, you know, and so I just became like an NC for like seven minutes. But yeah, that was a wild story. It gave me a little PTSD when you said thunder during your speech, so.

Tony: You got to be able to improvise, man. There’s nothing worse than when your tech goes out or something like happens with the PowerPoint or when you show up and they said it was going to be a microphone and it’s not a microphone. I remember one time I was giving a speech to a bunch of people that worked at UPS and I had to talk to them about the importance of giving and the importance of philanthropy. And I’m talking about basically 50 to 100 UPS drivers at like 6 a.m. that’s about to start their shift. I got no microphone. I’m just standing in a warehouse in the middle of all these people. And I’m just basically just screaming about the importance of philanthropy. But it was from the heart. So they enjoyed it. I think I was probably memorable actually. Like, man, I like that. I like that little guy. I didn’t know this was what I was signing up for. But you know, you got to improvise.

Micah: Yeah, for sure. For sure.

John: Wow. I’d say that comes up in the yoga studio for me a lot. This is the place where I’m giving a speech, leading an experience every single week. And there’s been some really random stuff that has happened in the yoga studio. One time I had a student just straight up reach out and grab my leg as I was walking around the class. And I’m teaching the class. Excuse me? What was that about? Were they into it or something? She just wanted an assist for the pose. And I was like, I appreciate how forward that was. So you just keep teaching, and you just go along with it. But what I find is the room reacts to your energy.

Tony: Thanks.

John: And if I were to get frantic when that happened, oh my god, what just happened? Why’d you do that? Is something wrong? And everyone in the room is like, and feels that. Like, what’s going on? The teacher’s uncomfortable? That means we should all be uncomfortable. Speaker’s uncomfortable? Something’s wrong. So it’s on us when the thunder strikes or when someone grabs your leg in the middle of the class to maintain that cool. when the music cuts out, when the mic goes off. It’s not there.

Micah: It’s non-existent.

John: Right. I was going to say, it’s never there. It wasn’t even there. Right? And when you just carry on and not even address it, music stops. And you’re just like, you just keep going, keep speaking, keep teaching. And then the audience is just like,

Micah: Okay, we’re just doing that. Let me ask you this, and maybe this is my host coming out because I’m over here asking questions now, but something that even happened today when your audience is different than what was expected. So today I was speaking for a leadership group for Tarrant County College, and it was supposed to be a mixed audience of students and staff, more students than staff. It’s like one student showed up, and now I’m speaking to a room of faculty and staff, and you have a presentation for freshmen. How do you navigate? I’m like, hey, guys, we’re just going to do a refresher on leadership. We’re all leaders in here. And so you just try to, I guess, go with the flow, if you will. But you ever had that happen to you?

Tony: Man, if I’m in a situation like that, I’m immediately pulling in the people. I’m immediately pulling in the staff to validate what I’m talking about or give me examples of how this is showing up for them. Because if they’re leaders in there, and whether they’re veterans, rookies, novice, it doesn’t matter. They have some experience, and that can help create a conversation that I would let happen organically, and then I go back to my material. I’ve probably been in that situation. That’s probably why I’m reacting with so much excitement.

John: Yeah, for sure. Man, that’s a really, really great question. I would say that if I came into that situation, and I can’t come up with an exact story I can think of, but what I would do and what I’ve done in similar situations is when something’s a little different, sometimes I’ll just ask the audience, what do you guys want to know? What did you show up for? Sometimes if I’m hosting a workshop or something and different people show up or I’m hosting an event for Cool Dad or something and I don’t know who’s going to show up, sometimes we’ll come into the conversation in the room and say, what do you guys want to know? What did you expect to leave here with? whatever comes out, usually it’s tied to something that I can speak to, and then just move from there. Because that’s like, how do you get to know your audience? Ask them.

Tony: Hey, I was going to ask y’all a question about virtual versus in-person speaking. So when COVID happened and we switched to hybrid, virtual world, all these things, like how did you naturally or was it not natural when you had to give presentations virtually? When you’re staring at a screen, you got the Zoom going, you got breakout, you got all these variables happening that did not exist pre-COVID because most times we weren’t giving full out speeches on Zoom, at least I wasn’t. So what was that change for y’all like?

Micah: I didn’t do very many, to be honest. I did about three or four. And the ones I did do were directly correlated to my film that I put out, Black Men in White Coats, which was a film about the lack of diversity in medicine. So I was speaking to not medical boards per se, but people who attended medical schools or who worked for medical schools, things like that. So it’s a really cool experience. I didn’t do very many though, but that was me.

John: It’s interesting that you said that. This is where actually teaching yoga and meditation really comes in handy because I’ll put everyone in an exercise immediately. All right, settle in. Just to make sure you’re present, we’re going to start with a five-minute meditation. You can turn your cameras off if you’d like and get started in that. It gets people and their bodies off the screen. And also, you have to set ground rules for a speech over Zoom or a workshop over Zoom. You got to set ground rules, like there will be a break for you to check your email. So I invite you to close everything on your desktop right now to be fully present. And here’s why. And it adds to it even more if you can have someone come on in leadership and speak about why they’re here today. Like, here’s why we invited Tony in to speak today. And this is why it’s important. If you have leadership example, like they’re putting their email away, they’re fully engaged, usually that will move down through the staff. But then if you have a general audience, I recommend like some kind of exercise, like even just some like light stretches or something, like get them out of their minds, into their bodies and seated, right? And that’s what works well for me. especially for virtual.

Tony: You know, I agree with that. A small thing that I’ve had to adjust to when it comes to virtual versus even a regular in-person speech is looking at that little dot, looking at that camera when it’s my turn to talk. Because I just want to look at the people while I’m talking, but then it’s like they’re all over the place. But when you can just take a moment to not look at the people and just take a look and straighten the camera. I feel like I connect with the people in the virtual meeting better. Like I feel like it’s almost like we’re looking eye to eye instead of me like wandering around, making sure the people are engaged with me, swiping the screen, like making sure everybody’s camera’s on. I just focus on locking in. Then that gives me the presence to say whatever I have to say. And I mean, I feel like it works. Some people have done it to me. I’m like really looking at them when they give their big talking points.

John: And related to that, sometimes I’ll shrink the whole window up towards that camera spot. So then it’s like, if I’m trying to see someone, then I really, really got to look, but I’m still keeping my eyes within that same spot on the camera.

Micah: Hopefully we’re in person from now on. Hopefully that’s the case going forward.

Tony: What about the people out there who may be listening and they say, I’m not a good public speaker, or I really do have that fear of public speaking. As people say, that’s the number one fear for a lot of people. What advice do you have for them?

Micah: I’m going to take Nike’s trademark and say, just do it. The reason why I say that is because no matter what I was fearful of ever in life, I can think of it. It could be going up to talk to the pretty girl in class. It could be raising your hand and speaking in class. It could be anything that required you to literally move. All of my nervousness, anxiety, and fear left when I did that said activity. And so before I go on stage, even right now, we talked about it, the comparison between excitement and anxiety and fear, all of that I still feel before I go on stage, before I go into that meeting. Once I get on stage and I see a smiling face and I start, If all that’s gone, my hands aren’t climbing anymore. I might get a little thirsty, get some water, it’ll be all right. But I think, not to take Nike’s line, but just do it. I think that’s the best way to fight that fear.

John: Yeah, I agree. There’s been, I remember even before football games in high school, I mean, it was, whether it was nerves, excitement, but I was known for it. I threw up before almost every single game.

Micah: Random side note, I threw up before my first meeting at Jen’s, the 6 a.m.s. I puked my guts on that ninth grade campus. I kept throwing up. I was so nervous, but sorry for interrupting, but he knows why we’re throwing up. You’re a freshman going in there like Dennis Hagen’s got a full beard in high school. I was scared out of my mind, so shout out to Dennis. But yeah, I threw up like crazy. Shout out to Dennis.

John: That’s great. But then after, but you were right. Like it’s then as soon as I got on the field and that first hit, gone. I’m not sick anymore. But again, it’s the story, right? Am I going to tell myself that I’m nervous and afraid? Am I going to tell myself that like, this is how fired up that I get before games, that my body wants to be light and ready to go. Empty.

Micah: Random side note, either of you ever skydived before? Never. You should both go skydiving. So what they do from the time, so I went skydiving. The time I went and signed my life away on this piece of paper, because you sign all your rights away. If you die, your people can’t sue, they get no money, it’s your fault, right? You shouldn’t have signed up. So as soon as you sign your life away, so you’re jumping out of a plane, was like 23 minutes, right? They don’t give you time to think about it. And so I remember, I’m strapped up to my guy, and like they open up the door, it’s like, all right, you ready? And he just crosses to the front, it’s like, I’m going to jump on three, one, boom, literally gone. Right? Because they don’t want you to think about it. So one of the things that I do, if I have the ability to go first during the presentation, if I have the ability to not have to wait, it’s the tension that kills you. It’s not the activity. It’s the tension waiting for the activity. So if I can get out there and go first, I’m going to go first every time because it doesn’t allow me to get inside of my own head. So that’s been my one of my big keys.

Tony: You know, for me, it’s repetition. So when you talked about Gents, so Gents was a high school organization that Mike and I were both part of, years apart, but in the same organization. And so for me, I was president of Gents for my senior year, and I had officer positions, but When I was in that leadership role, I constantly had to address the entire organization. So, you’re talking about 30, 40, 50 other young men, your peers, who really can like chop you down if you get up there and you’re just like not energized, you don’t say the right things, or you’re stuttering or whatever it may be. So, I quickly had to learn how to speak publicly and really control a room. Because I mean, like, these are kids. Like, we’re all kids, but we’re all, kids trying to do the right thing. And so that repetition has followed me from early or late high school to college to the real world and many speeches beyond. So I would also tell people to just get up there and get your reps up, even if it’s Toastmasters, which you could take Toastmasters, go up there and speak about any subject with no judgment because that’s the whole purpose and you’re building your reps up. So I did Toastmasters too. definitely recommend it if you have never spoken publicly.

Micah: Building your reps up.

John: That is huge. Even if it’s a small group. If this is something that you want to do, if you want to become a better public speaker, you can’t do it without getting your reps in, period.

Micah: Yeah, I’m going to say the most powerful book that I read in college was Malcolm Gladwell, 10,000 Hours. And I love about that. You got to get your 10,000 hours in, whether that’s, for me, video editing, whether that’s public speaking. If you want mastery or something, you got to practice. And so that takes me to doing those free public speaking gigs, because that’s how you’re going to build up those 10,000 hours. Yeah, for sure.

John: And we’ve been talking a lot about preparing mentally, preparing ourselves, doing the reps, and the way that we can interpret and tell the story about the situation. But when it comes down to tactically preparing for a, say there’s a specific topic, when it comes down to tactically setting that up, What’s your first step, or do you have a process how that works?

Micah: Yeah, I hadn’t really thought about my process, but one of the things that I do, say if you give me a topic on leadership or bridging the gap with millennials, I’m an avid reader, it looks like you are too, from the books in your house, I will literally go and grab like the six or seven books that I have on that topic, flip through, see what sticky notes I got, see what resonated with me at the time of reading that, and pull some quotes, and I start my presentations with quotes from other people. Because I feel like I don’t know anything, right? I’m just a curator of information. I think about how it has impacted me, and I just curate information and tell stories, right? Because I don’t know anything. And so that’s kind of where I start is other people’s information.

John: People want to hear stories. That’s how you keep people engaged. It’s like paint that picture for them, the imagery. Now that I say that, that’s actually something that I try to do as well when I’m preparing for a topic is like, what picture can I paint for them? How can I relate it to something that is tangible for the audience? When we think about great speakers and great speeches, and that was one of the things that made Martin Luther King’s speech so iconic, was it telling the story. about his children, about the way that he imagined his children playing and interacting with other students and other kids. The way that he painted that picture for everyone, everyone in the audience was not even at the speech, they were thinking about their children playing with all races and imagining what that was like. That’s a massive example. Yet there’s little ways that we can do that in painting the story for our audience. And I think that’s a great way to do it is starting with quotes, relating it to a story. And is there anything else, like real tactically, like an outline or do you drafts or anything else that you would recommend?

Micah: Handwritten notes. Handwritten notes. I write it all down. I wrote a book, and it started off with a handwritten outline. And then you start with a thesis, then you have a subtopic, then you have a subtopic to those subtopics. And that’s kind of how I outline it all. One other tactical thing that I like to do, and I don’t know, again, where I got this. I’m just a curator of information. But they said, practice at your lowest. And I remember that from being in band. I was also in band in high school. And they would make us do, for marching band, they would make you do three or four run-throughs. So we have a seven or eight minute show, you do a run-through of practice, go do it again, go do it again, go do it again, and you’re exhausted. So one of the things that I like to do is when I’m preparing for a speech, I’ll work an entire 12-hour day, go have dinner with the wife, come home, it’s 10.30, and I’ll try to do a presentation of my speech in my office or in my mirror. It sucks and it’s hard because you’re mentally drained. But if you can get through it when you’re at your lowest or at your worst or at your most exhausted period, I feel that I can get through it. When it’s 11 a.m., I woke up, had a nice cup of tea, some breakfast, and I’m talking to some cool people.

John: I love that. I love that. Anything that you want to add tactically, Tony, that you use before you prepare for something like that?

Tony: Well, I mean, subtly tactical, I would say is visualization. I try to visualize how the speech is going to go long before it happens. And the more that I visualize that in practice, kind of goes like 90% of what I hoped and thought it would. But I think it’s not really tactical. But the biggest thing for me is I try to have fun. I try to keep it fun. I try to go up there. I try to make people laugh. I’m not a comic, but I’m going to try to bring you a topic, but also make it a little lighthearted. Because a lot of times I’m brought in to talk about some serious stuff. I sometimes come and talk about diversity in the workplace. It can be a fun topic, but it’s usually hard because you’ve got to leave with facts and data and statistics. You know, I try to keep it light. I try to keep it funny. You know, when you talked about MLK and his speech, one thing a lot of people don’t know is that he threw the speech away and he was just mostly speaking from the heart. And when you are able to just speak from the heart and keep it light and not worry about if you stutter, if you stammer, if you mess up a word or if, did I say that right? And you just go. The audience feels that, man. That’s the people that connect with you and come up to you after the speech and make, man, I feel like you were talking directly to me. And that’s when you know it clicked. So I love just keeping it light and fun, man.

Micah: One tactical thing that I would actually want, I love your pacing. Even the way that you talk, just casual. I love your pacing. One of the things that I struggle with, especially when I get into it, that adrenaline starts pumping, you forget about the notes. My favorite part of a presentation is when people ask you questions. Because you’re put on the spot, and they give you a question that you’re invested in, and you start going. You start talking. At least for me, I start talking faster and faster and faster. So I would ask you, like I said, I love your pacing, but both of you all, what are you doing tactically to keep your pacing? That you’re not just speeding through content.

John: For me, and thanks. And for me, it comes down to, Back to seeing someone, because when I slow down and I really want to speak to one person, it helps me slow down more. But if I’m darting around or looking up to the sky or thinking about myself, that’s when a voice starts to speed up. And I start to ramble, fill little spaces. And it’s like when that judgment comes up, that’s when a lot of the filler words come up. I don’t know, kind of, it’s like, I’m just trying to stop the silence. And actually, the biggest thing that has developed that in me is becoming a professional coach, because it is professional listening. and being able to hold space for a client, and there’s a client in tears in front of you, going through into something deep, you know, deep topic, something comes up, and being able to sit and just be there with them. And so for me, it starts with those interactions with one person and being able to be there with someone and not have to fix what’s happening or find a solution. And I find that when I’m speaking and when my talk speeds up, it’s because I’m looking for a solution. What am I going to say? How am I being perceived? What’s going on? There’s always an inner dialogue going on, but when I focus on the audience, I focus on the client and what that’s going to mean to them and what are their needs and what does the audience need to hear. Sometimes if you feel like your audience isn’t engaged, Just say what’s on your mind. Sometimes it can work. Be like, what’s going on, guys? And say something that’s on your mind. I noticed this. How about you back there? Sometimes I’ll call people out too. Do you hear what I just said? Can you repeat it for the room? And sometimes it’s like a little joke or something. But yeah, for the pacing-wise, it really does start with seeing one person for me. Yeah, that’s good.

Micah: You just explained my speech today, not to cut you off, but literally started having that internal dialogue go off because you were throwing a curveball. I just said like, hey, I was supposed to speak to students, now I’m speaking to faculty and staff. I don’t have anything prepared for faculty and staff. So everything you just explained was literally my inner dialogue during today’s speech. So thank you. That was awesome.

Tony: Yeah, I was just going to add for me, it’s like a rhythm and a cadence that I try to talk at. Like sometimes I can talk really fast or then a lot of times I can just be more monotone and slower and just giving people like directive lecture almost style conversation. But when I’m doing that, I try to think of like an artist, like even a rapper, right? When they are giving their talks and they’re rapping, I mean, they’re giving it to you at a cadence at different speeds, but you’re listening. It’s all about the content and what they’re saying. So for me, I try to speak at a good rhythm and a good pace. And then also, if I’m giving a speech and maybe it’s going well, maybe it’s not, I don’t know, I’ll stop talking. I’ll slow myself all the way down to where I’m talking just like this. where now you’re listening to every word because I’ve slowed the conversation down. I’ll even say, y’all want to hear a secret? Lean in. Like, bring them into the conversation to where they’re really listening to what you got to say. And another thing I did mention is I also, when I say I try to keep it fun, I challenge myself a lot of times. Like, I’ll say, okay, you go into this speech, you already know what you’re going to say. Can you not say um? Can you not say, um, like challenge yourself just to not say, um. And that makes it fun for me. That makes it a game for you. That makes it like, I’m trying not to say that word while I give this amazing speech, you know, and I’m speeding my cadence up and down. And last thing I’ll say is one of my professors on my summer courses for my doctor program, he said, not to me, but to all of us to keep your slides super simple. I mean, just an image off Google is sometimes all you need. You don’t need a, over-exert yourself with trying to explain your topic. You can just put up a meme and talk about that meme, and then people will connect with that meme more than your words sometimes.

John: I wanted to just back on cadence, and that’s another thing that you can utilize as well, is varying your cadence in your speech to really emphasize something. Right? If I want someone to hear something, I’ll pause before what I’m going to say. And a nice, solid pause. and then go into the main point that you want to make. People hear it differently as opposed to being part of a long sentence. There is something in varying your cadence that can help emphasize certain points and leave space. Then one other thing that you brought up, the slides. is blank slides are huge, especially if you’re giving a talk in a big audience. When I gave that TEDx style talk at ExxonMobil when I was still there, I used blank slides a lot. It’s like when you want someone or an audience to listen to you speaking, and not be lost in the slide. Oh, what does that mean? What’s that image mean? What’s that word up there? I don’t really understand that sentence. They’re not hearing you, right? So I’ll turn the slides off. Sometimes the clicker will have a blank button, but I used blank slides there. Would flip to that next slide in that portion that I want you to see me when I drop this line, right? Blank slides are a huge way to emphasize your key points, or when you’re telling a story, you want people to listen to the story is another big part of it as well.

Tony: Last thing I’ll add to that is remembering that a lot of times when you’re brought on to speak, you’re the entertainer, you’re the entertainment. There’s no other performance than you giving that talk. I know I’ve said fun and light a lot, but I mean, remember that too. People may eat around or after your speech, but you are the reason why they came or you were selected for that event. So, you know, take pride in that too. I’d also add that for sure. Yeah.

John: How do you acknowledge yourself, Micah?

Micah: Define acknowledge yourself.

John: After what Tony just mentioned, you were invited. This was something that I was chosen for. How do you tell yourself, good job? How do you tell yourself that what you did right and what you want to give yourself some appreciation, a pat on the back for?

Micah: Yeah. One things I do that I hate doing, I record every presentation. As a media professional, I have cameras there all the time. And one thing I’ll notice, I haven’t watched myself from today, but I would give myself a four out of 10 on my skill. I did not feel like I gave my best performance today. And what I’ve learned sometimes is I go back and watch and I’m like, okay, I was a little hard on myself. It’s like a six, right? And then you can go through and technically break down what you can improve on. Okay, well, you ran through this or hey, that was not enough pause right there, right? Like little tactical stuff. But for me, what I love about the current project I’m working on is I get six iterations of doing the same presentation. And that is just golden for me. That’s like half a football season, right? I can literally watch film, Critique, try something new. Watch film, critique, try something new. And so I think that’s kind of, I don’t know if that answered your question, but.

John: Wow, I’m glad I asked it though, because it brought up a great point, is filming yourself, watching yourself speak is the best feedback that you can ever receive. because we are our own worst critics. We’re our own toughest critics when it comes to feedback, and that is huge. But then at the same time, that’s where the acknowledgment comes in. It’s even more critical to not just beat yourself up so much that we’re coming back to the growth mindset that we talk about so much on. this show is like building yourself up and acknowledging yourself for the progress that you’ve made already. And that I am in this room, that people were sitting and listening. Someone did come up after and get something out of it. So at the same time, while it’s good to be critical, laser in on the feedback, it’s also critical to acknowledge the work that you’ve done.

Micah: Yeah, and I think one of the things, to answer the question directly, how do I acknowledge myself? One of the things I like to do is look at how far I come, not how far I have to go, right? I get caught a lot. I watch this TED Talk, or I look at Tony, or I’m like, oh, I got to get there. I’m trying to get there. But then I go back and watch myself give a presentation in 2018 and I’m like, oh my goodness, I was like running through the presentation. I think I speak fast. Now I’m watching myself and I don’t understand what myself is saying in 2018, all right? So that’s how I acknowledge, hey, you’re better than that guy in 2018 and that deserves some, you know, pat on the back. You got some ways to go, but you’ve come a long way.

Tony: What are some of the things that you critique yourself on as you talked about when you’re watching the tape, what are you looking for?

Micah: My biggest thing, and it’s even with my podcast, and I’ve noticed this because I edit myself, right? It’s the combining of sentences. It’s the weird placement of commas and periods and sentences. So I almost did it right there, right? I had to stop myself before I went into that next point. You saw that? And so I’ve gotten better at setting up the big punchline. The hardest day of my life. Right? I’ve got that. I got that pause there. But it’s when I start running and I get into a story and I get into an example that sometimes those breaks are not happening. And therefore, I believe some people may miss the point that I was trying to make. So that’s been my biggest, I guess, pain point that I’m working on, even in the podcast.

Tony: You know, it’s funny that you brought up what you just said, because in coaching, I think we would call that stacking questions. That’s something that they teach you about in your ability to become a coach is your ability to not stack your questions, which is ask a question and then ask another question within that question because you’re trying to get your point across. because you can confuse the client. Like John was mentioning, you’re a professional listener, right? So when it’s your time to talk as a coach, you really got to get to the point quickly because it’s really all about them. So that’s like, as you say that, it just made me reflect on, wow, I hadn’t processed that. And I hope that when I give my next speeches, I’m able to listen to what you just said in the coaching practices and then just kind of bring that to my speech to just get to the point.

John: Yeah, and that also comes with being secure in your message, right? When you’re secure as a coach and you’re not trying to please the client, but you’re trying to co-create with the client. right, it relieves some of the pressure of asking the question. Because what I find when I see coaches and trainings stacking questions, it’s when they ask a question, and they can see on their client’s face that it didn’t quite resonate. And they’re a little confused. Oh, and then they add another question to it to see if that’s clear, to see if that’s clear. Just give the client a moment. So that’s kind of like being secure in, I am still whole. I am still worthy because I’m here. It’s the same thing when you’re up. Speaking to an audience like when you’re trying to please your audience like you’re not being yourself, right? It’s so that’s another just doing self-work whether that’s coaching therapy journaling like your own ways to unpack and understand how you can become more secure in yourself and That I don’t need the approval of the audience to be great I don’t need the approval of the audience to be worthy as a speaker. When you step into the room with that energy, people feel it. Now, this was a fantastic conversation. I want to give our listeners one thing to walk away with from each of us in regards to what we talked about today. If there’s one thing, Micah, were busy or forgot everything throughout this show, and one thing you wanted our listeners to leave with, what would it be?

Micah: Can I take two? Yeah, you can take two. I think the two things, going back to facing that fear of public speaking, is just to do it. Nothing moves unless you do. So if you want to accomplish something, if you want to get better at something, you have to start. So I think that would be the first thing I want people to leave with is to start. Get out there and just do it in my Nike voice. The second thing is to go back to what Tony said. Once you do it, then you got to have repetition. You got to do it over and over again. Talk about those 10,000 hours to get that mastery. It’s all about repetition. So that would be my two things. Get out there and just do it. And then once you do it once, do it a whole lot of times after that.

Tony: Man, I love how you live with that, and then you fall over repetition, because I was going to say that, but in repetition, it’s, you know, find your speaking voice. Be the best speaker that you can be. As you do those reps, it’s not about becoming any particular speaker that you see and you want to be like them. No, be the best you, and that’s all you got to do. So you hold yourself to that standard of the best speaker that you are, and you keep doing that, and you keep doing that. And like Micah mentioned earlier, record and watch yourself and see how you can tweak and technique your speaking abilities even better. Get even more crisp, you know, and find that voice that you really want to project to the audience. And the last thing I’d say is, have fun. Make it fun. You know, go into those speaking engagements knowing that you’re going to get another opportunity. So it’s not do or die. If you bomb, it’ll come back around. It’s OK. But go in there and make it fun. Challenge yourself and engage with your audience, man. They’re the ones that matter, not you.

John: really seeing the audience there. And just to piggyback on having fun, appreciate yourself, appreciate the work that you’re doing, appreciate how far that you’ve come, even when you take a step back as you move through your 10,000 hours. And thank you guys so much for listening. Hope you got everything that you needed from the show and you’re ready to get up on stage or up in front of the room. So you can find us anywhere that you get your podcasts and you can get more on the presentprofessionalpodcast.com. You’ll be able to connect with all three of us in the show notes. We’ll put everything in there for you guys to reach out, listen, connect. Again, thanks you for being a part of this community and until next time.